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Change is something we all struggle with, whether it’s losing weight, building a business, or improving relationships. We live in a world with more information than ever before—anything you want to know is a few clicks away. So why, despite this abundance of knowledge, do we still struggle to make lasting changes in our lives? The answer lies not in our lack of knowledge or even in our lack of motivation, but in our biology.
As Paul Levitin, host of the podcast Change Made Easy, explains, everything in life that we want to change is hard because it goes against our biological programming. Our bodies and brains are wired to survive, which means they naturally gravitate toward what’s easy and comfortable. Exercising regularly or eating healthy? That’s hard because it requires energy and effort, which our bodies would rather conserve.
So, if change is inherently difficult, how can we make it easier? The key is to stop fighting against this reality and start working with it. Accept that change is hard—there’s no way around that. But once you understand this, you can start looking for ways to make the process easier, so it becomes more sustainable.
Paul has developed a framework called EASIER that helps you create changes that stick by making the process as straightforward as possible. Here’s how it works:
The reality is that change will always be hard, but that doesn’t mean it’s impossible. By working with your biological inclinations rather than against them, you can create habits that stick. It’s not about making change easy—it’s about making it easier, so you can stay consistent and achieve your long-term goals.
Next time you’re struggling with a change, remember that it’s not just you—your brain is wired to resist it. But by applying the EASIER framework, you can make that resistance work for you rather than against you. Embrace the challenge, and you’ll find that change becomes not just possible, but sustainable.
In our fast-paced world, the ability to adapt and grow is more crucial than ever. Yet, many people struggle with making lasting changes because they approach the process with the wrong mindset. They believe that if something is hard, it must be the right way to do it. But the truth is, sustainable change comes from making the process as easy and enjoyable as possible.
By following the EASIER framework, you can set yourself up for success, not just in achieving your immediate goals but in maintaining those achievements for the long haul.
Lasting change isn’t about fighting against your natural instincts—it's about understanding them and finding ways to make the process easier. By working with your biology, you can create habits that last a lifetime.
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Kelly Berry (00:00) Hi and welcome back to Life Intended. I'm your host Kelly Berry. Life Intended is a podcast that explores what it means to be true to yourself and live an authentic and purposeful life. Each episode explores my guest version of personal growth, self -discovery, and the pursuit of becoming the best version of themselves, as well as how to find the joy in the journey. Today I have Paul Levitan here with me. Paul is also a podcaster. He's a public speaker and a coach. His podcast called Change Made Easy teaches anyone who feels struck or frustrated how to change their habits, routines, and behaviors in a way that feels easy and sticks forever. I'm really excited to have Paul on today because we're gonna talk about how to make becoming the best version of yourself easier. So welcome to the podcast, Paul.
Paul Levitin (00:52) Thank you for having me, Kelly. I'm super excited to be here.
Kelly Berry (00:55) Yeah, that's great. So your bio is pretty short and sweet. Can you tell us a little bit more about who you are, what you do, and your background and everything like
Paul Levitin (01:05) Yeah, for sure. So, you know, as you said, my name is Paul Levitan. Good job pronouncing it right. Lots of people don't get that right the first try. And I host a podcast called Change Made Easy. And everything I do from public speaking to coaching to my podcast is just about that one thing. How do I help people make whatever change they're trying to make in their life just a little bit easier? And I use that word change because to me, that is what underpins everything whether you're trying to lose weight, whether you're trying to start to go to the gym, whether you're trying to build a business or work on your relationships, anything you're trying to do implies that something has to change. So change is the thing that underpins everything else. So when we can understand what I call the rules of change, and when we can work with those things, things become easier and most people. We'll see that the same rules apply across genres. So it doesn't have to be about specifically weight loss, about specifically finance, about specifically business or whatever else. We just have to talk about the literal science of change. And the way I got here, I was, I started as a personal trainer and then nutrition coach and then health and wellness coach, and then all different types of coaches. And what I learned was this is all just change. Why is it that we can have all of the information in the which we all have, right? We all have a smartphone in our pocket that has the answer to literally every question in the world at any given moment. And we're still struggling. Why is it that I could give someone a workout when I was a personal trainer and they would not do it? Why is it that people will come to me and say, Hey, can you help me to lose weight? Tell me what to eat when Google can answer that for them. And I just came to understand that it's, we don't suffer from a lack of the year 2024, we can no longer use I don't know how as an excuse. If we're being honest with ourselves, you can say whatever you want. But if you're being honest with ourselves, I don't know how to do it is not is not an excuse. If you want to build a billion dollar business, you can go read how Jeff Bezos did it, how Steve Jobs did it, how how Richard Branson did it, like there's a literal step by step blueprint for literally anything that you want to do. So knowing how does not hold us back. And yet we still see people struggle.
Kelly Berry (02:54) Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.
Paul Levitin (03:17) Most people struggle. There's a 60 % obesity number in the US. Most marriages end in divorce. Most people wouldn't survive in America, at least, an unforeseen bill of over $1 ,000. So we have the most abundant information of all time. And yet we have the most unhealthy populace, the most financially in -depth, the most unhappy, and the list goes on and on. So to me, I was like, there has to be a disconnect here. And I just got very interested in the psychology of behavior change, because again, that was the one common thread that I saw that weaves its way into everything else. And that's what I pivoted away from specifically fitness, specifically nutrition, anything specific into more of a broader sense of how do I help people change?
Kelly Berry (03:44) Yeah, that's a great explanation and it's so true when you really think about it. And I also come from the fitness background and so behavior change, science and all of that, it's just, it's very prevalent. But to your point, it's so true. You can give somebody a blueprint, step -by -step list, a meal plan, a literal meal plan and a grocery list, know, and people are still struggling. So you said something in, that explanation about your definition of change or your, I think your, it was maybe like your principles of change. can't remember how you phrased
Paul Levitin (04:42) Yeah, so I said like the rules or right. So, know, it's more of like when I literally just talk about this as like the rules of life or the rules to the game, right? So the first one is that change is hard. That's like people will come and say like, like I just tried to do X, Y and Z. I'm just trying to be on this diet. I just feel so hard. No, it is hard. That's not a feeling.
Kelly Berry (04:45) The rules, yes. Yes.
Paul Levitin (05:09) It's hard. It is hard to do things that are good for you. That's why we err towards doing things that are not good for us. Doing things that are good for us is hard. Doing things that aren't good for us is easy. And human nature, in reality, the nature of all living things is to go towards what's easy and away from what's hard. This is the nature of every living thing. It will do what is least energy expensive as a survival mechanism. Because at the end of the day, our very cells in our body are fighting to survive. That's all the human body cares about. That's all the human brain cares about. That's all any animal cares about. Survive long enough to survive again. So everything, every decision that we make passes through this very simple decision -making framework. Will this take me closer to or farther from survival? And everything that you do that is better for you feels in that moment like it's taking you farther from survival. A workout is very good for you in the long run. But in the short term, it's hard, it's sweaty, you're using a lot of energy and energy is a finite resource. Eating something healthy, eating a salad instead of a Big Mac, a Big Mac is very high in calories. So from purely a survivalistic standpoint, eating a Big Mac, which is a thousand calories in a tiny little container is actually better for your survival than eating that salad, which might only be 500 calories if you were to be struck with a famine tomorrow. Now we don't live in a world where we're going to be struck with a famine tomorrow. I live in a world where the Big Macs are going to keep coming and keep coming and keep coming. But this is what I mean by the rules. So everything that we want to do is hard. And in our very DNA, we don't want to do hard things. So that right there is the crux of everything because now we are at an impasse. Why is everything so hard? Because it's at its very nature to be hard. And like I said, this is the rule because if you don't understand this and don't accept it, it's you're swimming against the current. Like you're fighting against nature in such a way that of course you're going to get frustrated. Imagine someone trying to swim upstream and being frustrated with how challenging it is. It's like, well, yeah, because you're swimming against the current. If you turned around and swam with the current, things would be so much easier for you. an analogy I like is like, imagine someone handed you the game of Monopoly and they said, all right, go play this game. But when you opened the box, there was no instruction manual in Like you would have not only would you not have a chance at winning the game, you would have no chance of even playing the game right. You wouldn't know what the pieces do. You wouldn't know what the dollars you would just be like, this is just literal nonsense to me. That's what people are doing when they don't know the rules of change. So when I have these conversations, this is not theoretically fixing anything. It's just allowing you to actually play the game the way it's meant to be played. Because otherwise, again, what people do is like, this is just so hard. It doesn't make any sense. And then they quit. And the reality you will get to wherever you want to be in life if you don't quit. This is the core principle that I've built everything that I do on. If you ask anyone who's successful in any area, whether it's fitness, finance, relationship, right? You go, I watch on Instagram all the time that they go up to old couples in the street and they go, how long have you guys been married? What's one secret after 50 years of marriage? And they just go, consistency, right? Consistency is always a word. Whether you ask the strongest guy, the most financially successful woman, whatever it is, it's like consistency. So we have all the information in the world and we know the secret to success is consistency. And yet we still can't put those two pieces together to just remain to be consistent. So when people get frustrated, that's what stops them from being consistent, right? A very easy analogy that most people will probably have experienced with is when they're dieting and it doesn't happen as fast as they would like. They go, I've been doing this for a month and I just haven't lost that much weight yet. The reality is if you did that diet for two years, I bet you, would get the result you wanted. But it didn't happen fast enough and they quit. So the thing is nothing, the thing is not the thing that doesn't work. It's not the diet or the exercise plan or the business plan or the whatever that doesn't work. It's the amount of time that you're able to commit to it. So my job as a coach, as a speaker, as a podcaster, is to just help people stay in the game long enough to actually get the result. And I do that by helping them see the reality of this is what you're up against. So they don't get so frustrated. So they don't talk themselves out of a good thing shoot themselves in the foot before they're able to receive the result.
Kelly Berry (09:31) Yeah. So I think it's interesting. know, it's, guess I would describe what you just talked about. It's like the biological friction of change. You know, it's like you, you do have your DNA and all of these things at work in causing that resistance. But I also think that we have like developed as a culture. And I've talked about this before, you know, it's a fixed mindset versus the growth mindset. We have a tendency to think that if something is easy, it's meant for me. And if it's hard, it's not meant for me to be doing it. I talk a lot about that professionally when you're working on new skills or where you're going after maybe a new job or trying to start a new business. When you're doing something and it feels really hard, you can think, I must just not be good at this. I must be made to do something else or meant to do something else. And I think that that also causes a lot of people to change direction or give up before had a breakthrough. Because culturally, that's what we teach people. If it's easy for you, if your kid is really good at sports and it comes easy to them, fan that flame. When in reality, maybe we should be doing some of the opposite.
Paul Levitin (10:48) Well, it's, I think it's both and there's nothing theoretically wrong with that. It's just that we have to understand again, that doing hard things is a part of the process. And something being hard is not, I say all the time, it's not a fault. It's not, it's not a mistake. That's the thing that tells you that you're actually in the right place. When you're exercising, this is the whole thing about, you don't just walk on the treadmill and you got to run or don't lift a little, little tiny dumbbells, lift heavy. It's like it is the very feeling of this is too hard that tells your body to adapt. And that's the truth in anything in life. In fitness, it's the principle of progressive overload. You have to give yourself enough reason to adapt in order for that to happen. And the same thing in reading, in learning, anything. If you're not pushing yourself to a certain limit, then you're not stretching yourself. now like all other things, this can be taken to an extreme. And that's where we get the no pain, no gain ethos, which we know is, which we know is wrong. This is where we get like, just, just grind, just push, just push. Like there's a balance to be had with everything. Yes, you have to be willing to push through hard things. And to your point, just doing whatever comes easiest to us can lead people down a, the wrong path, because then we get, we become soft and we don't know how to deal with adversity when it comes. I say, and I'm very specific with my words, when adversity comes, not if adversity comes. This is the point. This is why, this is why to what you're saying, like when people are just doing what's always easy is because if you're doing what's always easy, eventually it's going to be hard. And when it is hard, if you don't know how to deal with that, that's what flattens people. So, you know, my whole thing with like change made easy, because people will hear that they go like, well, it can't be easy. You have to you have to do hard things, but that's kind of my point. It's always going to be hard. Whatever you want to do is going to be whether it's work on your body, work on your finances, work on your business, any improvement you want to make to your life is going to be hard inherently. We know that because if it wasn't hard, you would have already done it. No one sets a goal to eat more KitKats. No one sets a goal to watch more Netflix. No one sets a goal to be broke. Those things are easy and they happen automatically. The only thing you have to set a goal for, you're saying like, it's my goal to do X, Y, and Z, what you're saying this thing is so hard that I'm not doing it naturally. So I have to go outside of my current skill set to do something extra to get it. So by the very nature of something being a goal, we're saying that it's hard. but now going back to the biological stuff we were talking about. now like in saying that, in not so many words, I'm also saying, and also I don't really want to do that consciously. might, cause consciously I might see like, I know that I want to have the result of the light at the end of the tunnel but somewhere deep in my subconscious where I care more about safety and security, I'm going to push back against that. So with change made easy, it's like, we already know it's hard. So let's make it as easy as possible. There's always going to be some challenge. There's always going to be some friction. There's always going to be some pushback. But the point is that everything exists on a spectrum. I want to find the easiest way to get the result rather than what most people do is they're just like, well, if it's going to be hard, just do the hardest thing possible. And that's how you get the most results, but that's how you burn out. That's how you get frustrated. That's how you end up quitting. So instead it's how do we find the easiest way to get you to your desired result? There's still going to be some challenge implied in that, but we do it in a way that feels good so that you can do it for the long term so you can stay consistent. And that is how you get real sustainable results that aren't just some six week or six month flash in the pan that how you change for your entire life.
Kelly Berry (14:27) Yeah, so how do you do that?
Paul Levitin (14:29) Good question. So, right. So I take people through a framework that's called EASER. So it's an acronym, E -S -I -E -R. I mean, couldn't make it easier than that, right? Like I try to make everything so simple, but that's It all hinges on exactly that. Like you make it so stupid simple that people don't have a choice but not to do it, right? So the EASER framework, I'll walk you through it super quick and we can double tap on any of pieces that you want. So E stands for enthusiasm. So that's the first step. Are you enthusiastic about not only the goal, but the action steps that it takes you to get there? So this is a huge mistake that people make right out of the gate. They go, I want to lose 30 pounds. Cool. Are you enthusiastic about that? Of course, when I'm 30 pounds less, I'll be on the beach, I'll be so much more confident. People won't look about, but okay. But are you enthusiastic about what it takes to get to lose 30 pounds? Meaning are you enthusiastic about changing your routine so you're waking up earlier so you can go to the gym? Are you enthusiastic about what you have to change in your diet? Are you enthusiastic about cutting back on alcohol? Well, no, I don't want to do any of that. Well, it's like, okay, well, I can assume that you're probably not going to stick to that routine. You're probably not going to stick to that habit in the long term. And that means we need to edit something so that we can find a way for you to feel better. So are you enthusiastic about not only the goal, because I think that's what most people do. Are you enthusiastic about having a million dollar business? Of course. Are you enthusiastic about working three jobs until you get there? no. Right? So that's part one. A is available. Is this available to you with your current set of restrictions? Right? I want to start a business, but I work a full -time job and I'm a mom with three kids and whatever else. It's like, okay, well, how much time do you have available to an hour a day. Okay, can you make that work within an hour a day? No, I need four hours a day to make this business work. Okay, well, like you're setting yourself up for failure before you start. You're not going to be consistent with that. EAS stands for straightforward. Can you tell me in straightforward language how you're to get from A to B, B to C, all the way to Z? Forward and backwards, right? So simplicity is the key. Complexity is the killer of dreams, right? Everyone wants to get somewhere. And then when we get into the details of how are you going to do They're like, well, I don't really know. like, okay, well, in sales, we like to teach a confused mind doesn't buy, right? So like, if they don't know what you're pitching exactly, they're going to go, I got to think about it. Your brain does the same thing when you're trying to get it to do a new habit. So when you're saying get up early to go to the gym because you want to lose weight, but you don't know exactly how the habit of getting up early links to your weight loss, your brain subconsciously always looking to conserve energy is going to go screw this snooze right now. This is really conserving me energy and I'm going to keep doing that. So that's EAS. I stands for imperfect. Perfection is again, and we all know this, right? You've probably talked about this before. Perfectionism is the thing that stops the most people, right? Perfection stops us dead in our track. We know that it is impossible to be perfect. We can never be perfect. But I take it a step further kind of going back to your point about, you know, are you willing to do hard things? You have to be willing and actually excited to do imperfect things, to take imperfect action, to do what you're going to mess up on. Right? So if I'm, because to your point, if I'm only doing things where I'm being perfect all the time, am I actually challenging myself? Am I actually pushing myself? So I have to be willing to be imperfect and look for the things that are making me mess up, make mistakes and stumble and still be enthusiastic and excited about doing those things. Because if I could be enthusiastic about the screw ups, about the fall offs about the stumbles, then that's the easy path to getting where I want to go. So that's E -A -S -I. The second E stands for exponential. So going back to the whole biological imperative to want to conserve energy, I want exponential returns on my investments. Exponential meaning I want huge returns for the littlest input. So a perfect example is people with fitness will always go like, well, did you know that working out is great for your mental health? So it's good for your body and it's good for your mental health. And like they say that, like it's some revelation, like everyone's going to be, it's like, if that were enough, the world would be skinny, right? Like we all know that, like no one, I don't think anyone is sitting around anymore, not knowing that exercise is good for your mental health. But you know what else exercise is? It's hard and it's time consuming. So those two cancel each other out right out of the gate. We've got two benefits and we've got two minuses. So when I think of a habit or a new routine or something positive that I'm trying to build into my life, I want to think of
Kelly Berry (18:54) Yeah.
Paul Levitin (19:15) potential benefits, 20 potential benefits that that single thing gives me. that, because always I'm going to have the negative of it's time consuming, it's new, it's hard, I don't want to do it, it sucks. That's five negatives right there. So if I don't have at least double that, my brain, again, my subconscious is going to have a perfect excuse to go, no, this isn't worth it. So that's E -S -I -E. And the last letter R stands for repeatable. Is this repeatable from now until forever? Because a lot of people, do things where like, again, weight loss, I'm going to do this diet until I lose the weight. I'm going to grind in my business until I make enough money. I'm going to do whatever it is until this point. And it's like, if you're setting yourself up with that mindset, what you're saying is I can only do this for a limited amount of time. And I'm hoping that what the timeline that I've predicted is the one that it actually takes, which we all know all projects take at least two to five times longer than than we set out to. So if you're not coming into it with, can do this forever, you're probably going to get messed up at some point. It's going to take longer than you thought and you're going to want to quit. Whereas if I do something going back to the first E enthusiasm, I do something that I'm enthusiastic about. I'm getting exponential returns, meaning I'm getting so much more out than I put in. It's available to me. It's simple. I can do that. Why would I ever want to stop? Now it's repeatable. Now it's something I can do forever. So the way I tell clients is like, if this is something
Kelly Berry (20:37) Thank you.
Paul Levitin (20:44) I can only do for a certain amount of time, then I don't want to do it at all. So if you're coming and starting with the idea of like, yeah, I could stick to this diet for like six months, but I don't know any longer. It's like, again, we need to go back to the drawing board and start it the first part and redo the whole thing from there. So I know that was kind of fast. I just threw a lot at you, but that's the framework that I walk people
Kelly Berry (21:00) Mm -hmm. Yeah. Yeah, I love that. First of all, I think there's a fitness analogy for everything, which I think is great. It's so easy to understand, so relatable. But I love your framework. It reminds me of like smarter goal setting. But that does truly make it easy to think about how can you set yourself up for success from the beginning? Because as you were talking, I'm thinking about all of the ways I've set myself up in life for goals across so many different spectrums. But how many times have I created a plan to hit something, gotten off track, and instead of adjusting the plan, I just start the same plan over again and again and again. And I mean, if that's not the definition of insanity, it reminds me of like always starting a diet on Monday. It's like, well, if I mess up on Wednesday, I'm going to throw in the towel and just start it over on Monday and never make any adjustments to the plan. I guess as you were talking, there's a lot of recognition. I could say it about reading, you know, if I want to read a book a month or whatever it is, 10 pages a day, you know, it's like if I fail, I just start the same freaking goal and freaking process over again instead of making any changes. So that was enlightening.
Paul Levitin (22:22) Yeah, I that. Well, one, I again, I come back to fitness and diet as an analogy because of my background. And I think it's something that's super relatable. But again, this kind of transcends that if you can take out anything that I use fitness for and plug in again, relationships, can plug in finances. but to you, to your point that that's the the reason that this all feels so like accessible is that that's it. That's exactly it. I learned this or I created this because it's just like the way I use this framework is think of a habit that you want to start. So again, whether it's like you said, reading a book a week or a book a month or whatever it is, I then run that habit through this framework. Am I enthusiastic about it? Is it available? Is it straightforward? And if I can run it through that whole framework, that's a habit I can feel like I'm going to stick to. And if I have any speed bumps along the way, again, I need to start from the beginning and simplify it more to make it easier because you'll find that any habit that you have stuck to, if you run it through that framework, you're gonna say it actually checks all those boxes. And any habit you can go back and think about any habit that you've tried in the past that have it, you can go and you're gonna see at some point you're either, you weren't enthusiastic about it, or it wasn't straightforward, you didn't really know what you were doing, or you weren't okay with taking imperfect action, you had perfectionist tendencies, and every time you messed up a little, you threw the whole thing out, or again, it wasn't repeatable in the long term, whatever it was, there's always a check along that thing. And then people will go like, okay, well, like, don't, isn't the answer just to man up, just to do it, right? Right. Discipline. Right. Exactly. Willpower or something like that. It's like, no, it's not. That's, that works for short -term goals. So if your goal, if you, you're, you're a business owner and you're like, we have a deadline. I, this vendor contacted me and I have to be out. The thing has to be done by September 1st and it's August 1st. You have two months then yeah, you do whatever you have to do. You put your head down and you grind. That's when willpower comes in. But when we're talking about lifetime goals, health, wealth, relationships, these things don't end. There's no end date for your health. You start exercising right now at 30, 40, 50, whoever's listening to this, you don't get to go, okay, hit my goal weight, check, lock it in, save game, and now go back to what I was doing before. You have to do this for 20, 30, 40, 50 years. But eating healthy is the same. Working on your relationship. I use the example of relationships a lot because I think that's just as important if not anything else. It's like you're working on your relationship with your significant other. You guys are 50 years you might be married for. Like that does not stop after you guys go to couples therapy for two years or something like that. This stuff is life long. So for that stuff, no, willpower is not the answer because you cannot willpower your way through the next 50 years. You cannot discipline your way through the rest of your life. Like that, and when people try to do that, that is again where they reach frustration and they reach burnout and they quit and they go in the doom cycle, which we've all seen. So that's what this is for. This is for big life goals that we have to do no matter what. People say, well, I'm just so busy right now. Unfortunately, your body doesn't care how busy you are. Your body doesn't go, okay, eat junk food all day and I'll turn it into good protein vitamins because you're busy. Your body doesn't go, okay, it's fine. We don't need to exercise anymore because your work is so busy. These are life, habits that have to happen no matter what. And for those, the answer is not grind, willpower, muscle through it, man up, whatever stupid thing you want to use. The answer is make it so easy that even with all of the real life constraints that you have, which everyone has, yours are different than mine. Mine are different than yours, are different than my sister's, are different than your but we all have them, make it so easy that none of that matters and you can still get it done anyway.
Kelly Berry (26:13) Yeah. So what do you do when you've got somebody who, know, say they do need, you know, they need to work on a lifelong habit, but they do have like a very short term aspect to that. So, you know, say somebody needs to lose 30 pounds and once they do you know, maybe they need to switch their habit and start to work on more lifelong health or, you know, what does that look like? Especially for you know, people right now who need like short term instant gratification. They want, you know, fast results. It's kind of a hard sell to be like, well, you just got to change your mindset and buckle up for the long
Paul Levitin (26:50) Yeah. Yeah, trust me, I know exactly what you're talking about. I've dealt with this many times. So there's two ways to look at this. So the first is, again, I'm just realistic with people. No amount of you wanting it to happen faster will make it happen faster. All that you wanting it to happen faster is going to do is make yourself frustrated and make you quit. It's going to take however long it's going to take. if you can, like the best thing you can do, as annoying as this is to hear when people are coming to me for weight loss, And they're like, I'm talking about changing your mindset. But the reason I want to change your mindset, you have to understand this, you know, like, this is that way I explained to me was like, understand that your goal is the goal. Right? So if you come to me and say, Hey, Paul, I want to lose 50 pounds or Hey, Paul, I want to build a business. want to become an entrepreneur. I want to leave my nine to five job. And now I'm like, okay, cool. We have to work on your mindset. And you're like, what I like, no, like I want to start losing weight right now. It's like, understand that the goal is still the goal. The goal is still that 50 pound loss. I, with everything that I've learned, everything that I've done, the thousands of people that I've worked with, the thousands of people just like you who I've helped, have still come to the conclusion, I understand, I'm hearing what you're saying, that weight loss is your ultimate goal, and I'm telling you that the route to that result is still to take the first three months to work on mindset and then go on, because in the long run, in over the course of a year, you will have lost more weight net, right? Because you're actually doing it in the right way rather I mean, it's the tortoise and the hare, right? Rather than running so fast in the beginning that you burn yourself out or whatever else. So there's that aspect of like, do you really need to be doing it fast? That's the first conversation I have with people. it's like, most of the time it's no, you're just impatient. You want it to happen fast because the part where you're doing it sucks. But that goes back to you're not enthusiastic about it and it's not sustainable. it's right. So it's like, again, like you're you messed up along that choosing the goal is where most that's the whole point. It's like If you're saying, need to do this fast so it's over, it's like you already messed up. You picked the wrong goal because now you want it to be done too fast. That's not repeatable, right? Going back to the R in the easier framework. Now there are times when it actually is, right? It's like, I'm getting married in three months. I know I should have started two years ago, but I didn't. I have three months. Okay, like in that time, that's where I go back to now. We can talk about willpower. Now we can talk about discipline. Now I can put on coach, my coach had just go, rah, just get up, just do it, blah, blah. Like there's a time and a place for that. It's a very small, very, very specific time and place that I don't like personally, and I don't go too often. But if that's what you got to do, that's what you got to do. Same thing again, you have a business deadline. You might have to go to sleeping four hours a night and staying up late days and whatever else, because you just got to get it done. That happens in life. But I think that that happens far less than people like to think it does. And most people put themselves into that box purely out of impatience because they don't want it. They want to get through the hard part, right? Going back to again, going right back to the beginning of the conversation. Human nature is to want to not do hard things. So when you're doing something hard, whether it's dieting or exercising or working on a business, your brain and your body want to speed through that part. They want it to happen as fast as possible. So it's over so they can get to the other side of the rainbow. They can be done with that and they can go back to, that now again, I'm going in circles, going back to the easier framework.
Kelly Berry (30:10) Yeah.
Paul Levitin (30:11) The whole point is there is no other side of the rainbow when it comes to health. If you're dieting, like, I just want to diet till I can lose this weight and then I can go back to what? You're go back to doing what you were doing before and then you're gonna go back to what you had before. So if you're talking about a diet, we have to set it up in such a way that you don't ever feel like stopping doing it. So it doesn't matter if it happens in three months or three years, it's gonna happen and you're just gonna feel good while you do
Kelly Berry (30:34) Can you give some examples of ways that you help people take these goals that they may be at surface totally unenthusiastic about? I think weight loss is a really good one. A lot of people just really hate exercise. You're really not going to put anything in front of them that they're going to love. So how do you help them take something like that and become enthusiastic
Paul Levitin (30:50) Mm -hmm. Yes, perfect example. 100%, yeah, I got you. 100%, perfect example, right? The exercise one is the one that comes up the most often, right? Well, I just don't like exercise. My doctor said I have to exercise, but I don't want to exercise. I don't like exercise. I've gone to the gym, I hate it. You're not gonna get me to like it. It's like, all that is to me is a lack of imagination. Because what you're looking at is exercise in one specific way. Exercise means going to the gym. Okay, I can see how you don't like that.
Kelly Berry (31:01) or frame it, guess, in a way that they're actually.
Paul Levitin (31:28) going to the gym and lifting weights might be good, but if you're telling me you're not gonna do it, then that's fine. What about Zumba? What about rowing? What about climbing? What about hiking? What about walking? What about dancing while you do the dishes? What about stopping every 30 minutes while you're working from home and just doing 10 squats in the air? What about doing a million and one other things that constitute exercise that you're not thinking of as exercise, right? It's like that's whole thing. It's altering their perspective of what this could be because they'll go, well, I know I heard that lifting is the best thing, so I'm supposed to lift weights. Okay, but you just told me that you hate lifting weights and you're not going to do it. So you're letting, again, perfection be the ideal rather than say, like, I'm going to do this good enough to get the result and then actually get it. I say a lot to my clients, like, don't optimize yourself out of doing the thing at all. So people try to make things so good, but you're not even doing it. They're like, well, I know I'm supposed to go to the gym and lift three times a week. And it's like, but you're not going to do So it doesn't matter if that's the quote unquote best thing, if you're not gonna do it. Like, and I'm like, what if you just walked? And they're like, well, walking isn't as good as lifting weights. It's like, okay, but will you walk? Yes. Will you lift weights? No. It's like, okay, well then it's as good for you and it's as good as you're gonna get. And now you have to go back to the reality of yes, your results might not be the same as if you were to go into the gym and lift four days a week, but something is better than nothing. And at least now you're on the path to doing. So again, it's just an altered perspective of like getting people out of this mindset of they're like, I've tried this and this didn't work, or I just don't like this, I don't like how it feels. I went to the gym and people were looking at me a million other things, which is fine, right? Like that's, I respect your experience. But again, are you pigeonholing what exercise is? It's the same thing with eating healthy. People are like, well, I tried eating healthy and it's just like, I just don't like those foods. It's like, okay, again, just a lack of imagination. There's so many different ways you can cook healthy. There's so many fruits and vegetables out there that you've never tried. There's so many things. It's just like, if you could just get out of the box of what you think this is supposed to look like, you can see a lot more options and you can find the one that you are enthusiastic about. And now we continue that. Someone can go, no, but there's not a single, I looked at every single type of exercise, then I hate all of them. It's like, all right, well then you find the one that you hate the least. At the end of the day, like, yes, for something again, like exercise, like, you, again, if you want to live a long, healthy life. You can choose not to do that and then you don't have to exercise and that's fine. But if you're saying, wanna live a long, healthy life, I wanna do it at a healthy weight, I wanna have a good quality of life into my 60s, 70s, 80s and beyond, it's like, okay, if you want all of those things, then you do have to be physically active. Now, here's a dropdown menu of 80 different things that you could do to get to that goal. Some are gonna be more impactful than others. Right? Playing tennis at high intensity might burn more calories than playing pickleball. But I don't want to learn tennis and I can play pickleball tomorrow. So for me, pickleball is a better option that I'm going to go with rather than saying like, well, what's going to be the most optimal thing to burn the most calories and blah, blah. It's like you're talking yourself out of the thing already. it's finding again, again, one, it's just being more open minded to what potentially could be. And then sometimes it's picking the lesser of the evils.
Kelly Berry (34:34) Mm -hmm. Yeah. It's like you're speaking directly to me. So I have a two year old daughter. Prior to having a daughter, I have been like an endurance athlete, a triathlete, all of these things. And I'm having such a hard time with the mindset of like switching gears and what exercise and health looks like for me now, because I do not have the number of hours per week that I used to put towards it. And I get so in circles about like, You know, I can't just go on a 20 minute walk after lunch. Like that's not going to do anything. And so yeah, you're just really speaking to me with this one. Exactly. But I wanted to ask you another question because something that we've done in our business for a long time and I've talked about on the podcast before is, you know, like setting annual goals for yourself and breaking those down into quarterly objectives and, know, even looking out like three years, How does your framework that you've set up for setting goals fit into like, I guess kind of like an ever evolving life and changing goals?
Paul Levitin (35:53) Yeah. So I look at goal setting in two ways. I don't do like one year goals, three year goals. I just have big goals and little goals. So big goals are your vision board goals. That's lose a hundred pounds, be the CEO of my own business, have a thriving family and a vacation home and whatever, you know, those are the goals that motivate you to move forward. That's the thing that you're looking towards. But those goals on their own do nothing for you because they're so far out in the future that they actually become demotivating if that's all you have. Because if your goal is to lose 100 pounds and you step on the scale at tomorrow and it didn't even budge or God forbid it went up a pound, you're going to throw your computer at the wall. So you have big goals, but then we have our daily action goals. Small goals are daily action goals that are the thing that move us towards the bigger goal. So you can break this down as many times as you want. Okay, if I have my big goal is again, you know, lose a hundred pounds or start a million dollar business, let's say we move away from the fitness analogies, right? Start a million dollar business. Okay, how long is that going to take realistically? Give myself five years. Okay, where do I need to be two and a half years from now to be on track on pace to doing that? Okay, where do I need to do be a year from now to be on pace? Right? You can just reverse engineer it from there and you get all the way down to where do I need to be at six months from now? Where do I need to be at the end of this month? Okay, to be at the end, to be there by the end of this month where do I have to be this week? And to be there this week, what do I have to do today? And that's when we get to your actual daily habits, routines and behaviors, the daily action steps that move you closer to that goal. So you might have figured out that to be at a multi -million dollar business five years from now, today you have to reach out to three prospective new prospects. That is a tangible, trackable action step that you can track, you can build on, you can grow on, you can scale. But it all runs through the same framework of like, is this easy enough that I'm gonna wanna do it? Now again, there's a give and take here where it's like, depending on how much you want that end goal, being a million dollar business, you might have to do some things that you don't really wanna do. You might hate doing outreach to clients, but if you really want, and that goes back to enthusiasm, right? Am I actually that enthusiastic? Because everyone wants the result, right? I call these magic wand goals.
Kelly Berry (38:12) Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.
Paul Levitin (38:13) Right? Everyone, if I could wave a magic wand and give it to you, you'd say yes, right? But if I could give, wave a magic wand and have you lose 30 pounds, have bigger muscles, have a better business, have better, it's like, of course you would take that. You would accept it if it was handed to you, but that's not a goal. That's a wish. The question is, will you do the thing that it takes to get there? That's a goal. And so if you can say yes to that, then it's great. And then you work on that and you scale it up accordingly. So I work forward and backwards. So backwards is again, you start with a timeline. You break it down, you reverse engineer it to get your daily action steps. And then going forward, you have daily and weekly goals. And that's actually tangible and trackable. So you can see, I working? I doing the thing that I actually need to do? Am I tracking my calories? Am I hitting my workouts? Am I getting my steps? Am I doing my KPIs in my business or whatever else it is so that you actually do have something that's tangible and trackable. So you can go, hmm, I haven't lost any weight in a while. And then I can look, how many times this week did I hit my macros? How many times this week did I hit my steps? How many? whatever, and you have something to change if things aren't working
Kelly Berry (39:16) I love Yeah, I think this is great. I love your framework. And really, when we go back to the core of what we're talking about, the easiest change that you make is the change that you only have to make once. To go back to the fitness, weight loss analogy, how many people have you met who've lost 20 pounds 50 times? You know what I mean? Wouldn't it be nice if you just lost 20 pounds one time and moved on and maintained? So I love the way that you approach Anything else that you have about your framework or making changes that you want in your life easier?
Paul Levitin (39:56) So again, I think that people can run it through this framework. And also for anyone listening, I have this framework as like a PDF checklist. So if anyone wants, they can reach out to me on my podcast or social media, or I can send you some information to get this as a checklist. So you can run through this checklist and do it. I want to come back to what we kind of said at the beginning about the rules and stuff. Like when I say this stuff, this is not like my theory, This is just how it is. So when people push back against this, I'm like, okay, do what you want to do and you're going to see what happens. This goes back, like I said, double check, anyone listening to this. Think about a habit that you tried that didn't work and run it through this framework. And then think about a habit that you found that did work. You're going to see that the stuff that does work just naturally adheres to these rules because that's how it works. You stick to the things that adhere to these rules. That's how I figured this out. like, okay, it's Why do the successful people do this? Or how do people become successful? They become successful because either knowingly or not, they do the things that are right. So like someone who is a super rich person, they'll be like, well, I I got up, I meditated, I always prioritize exercise. did X, Y, and Z, and like you're reading their biography. It's like they didn't learn that from someone. They didn't have to read Tim Ferriss or whatever other stupid blog to know how to do that. They just inherently knew. Like success has been around longer than podcasts and books. So these principles are just some people get them inherently and those people are lucky and some people have to work to get them. And that's you and me and most people. So this is just stuff that I think is like, again, when you see it, now you're playing the game by the rules. Now we get to go, okay, now I see why every time I try to do that or every time I lose 20 pounds, I feel good about it. But then I end up falling off because it was never I was never enthusiastic about the diet that I was doing. I was enthusiastic about losing the 20 pounds, but as soon as I lost the 20 pounds, I stopped doing the keto, carnivore, whatever thing that I was doing. And then I was like, okay, I can see how I was falling into the same trap. just like the last thing is I will say it's like the easiest way I people to kind If you don't want to go through a whole framework, if you want to just make this super simple, right? Make it easier. I'm always, I don't want to make things more complicated than they have to be. When you're thinking about doing a new goal, new habit, a new routine on a scale of one to 10, how confident are you that you can do this consistently? One being is thing ever And I'm going to fall being This is the easiest thing. I could do it in a bubble bath, reading a newspaper. Like I could fall asleep and this would still happen. And I say, how confident are you that you're going to maintain this habit? If your confidence is not a nine or a 10, then that habit is too hard for you. So most people come in at six and sevens. they're like, I'm going to do this diet. Like how confident are you that you can stick to that diet? I'm a seven. Like I think it's pretty good. They say that thinking that's good. It's like, no, what you're telling me is that you don't want to do it, but you're going to try to willpower your way through it. So we've already failed before we've even started. So I'm going to say, we don't even need to do that. How can we make this a nine or a 10? And you keep dumbing it down until it's so easy that literally, again, you could fall asleep and you would still do this thing. Like you could stumble out of bed and trip into your goal. And then people say, isn't that too easy? Like, how am I going to get anything like that? Because again, consistency is the name of the game.
Kelly Berry (43:07) Mm -hmm.
Paul Levitin (43:37) If you go to any gym, worked in person as a trainer at a gym for over 10 years. The guys or the girls, the ladies, the women, the men, whoever had the best bodies in the gym, the most, I throw air quotes out there for anyone who's just listening, the best bodies who everyone's go, oh my God, that guy, that's exactly what I want. I'll go, you know what that person does? It's not the best workout. I watch them work out all the time and I know how to work out. That person has no clue what they're doing, but they're here all the time and they have been for 10 years and that's You could go into the gym and bang your head against the wall for an hour, five days a week, and you'd burn calories and you'd lose weight. You don't have to do it like, like just doing a thing. Yeah, obviously if you could do the thing and do it well, and then you'll have double the, double the amount of progress, but just doing the thing will take you so much farther. Same thing with business. Every, every entrepreneur will say like, I just showed up and I never quit. Okay. So how do we get you to do that? And we do that by making it so easy that you don't want to not do it. And if you can do that, you're going to
Kelly Berry (44:26) So our background actually is in business coaching for gym owners. And when we set goals and we walk through the plans with them before the session is done, we will say on a scale of one to 10, how confident are you in this plan? And if they do not answer a nine or a 10, we go back, we revisit the plan and we recreate it. Because to your point, if you start out and you are not confident that you can take the steps and make it happen, then you're failing before you even get started. So I love carrying that over into this, you know, like more personal goal setting framework. Yeah, that is great. If you're cool, I'm going to switch gears for just a couple minutes and talk about your podcast. You mentioned your checklist and if it's cool with you, I'd like to include that in the show notes. We'll include your podcast link, your social profiles, all of that good stuff. But I'm We were talking before we started recording. So today is July 23rd, the day that we're recording. I actually, it's my 90 days into podcasting, but Paul has been podcasting for three or four years. So how many episodes, do you know how many episodes you've done?
Paul Levitin (45:47) Um, somewhere between 330 and 350 right now, depending. I record in batches and then release them over time. So I'm not exactly sure that I've kind of been a, I've been moving. talked about this before we got on. I've been moving. I prerecorded a bunch and like they've just, they're just going out on autopilot right now, but somewhere almost approaching 350.
Kelly Berry (45:52) Yeah, that, to talk about goal setting and things like that, from 90 days in, I can tell you, that takes a whole lot of commitment just really wanting to do the thing. So what drives you to continue to talk about this topic and create this information and create so many great podcast episodes?
Paul Levitin (46:34) I mean, it's everything that we've been talking about for the last, you know, however long 45 minutes or so it's this is everything that I care about. It's everything. It's a culmination of everything I learned as a personal trainer, as a nutrition coach, as a sales coach. This is the stuff that's so important to me because this is just the truth. This is reality. This is to me, it's like it's when I first started to understand this stuff, it's like you I left the matrix like once and once you once you see it, you can't unsee it. And like it's like the only thing that makes sense to me is to spread this message because it helps people. I've helped people and I continue to help people. And in a world where you have a choice of how to spend our time, to me, helping people live better, happier, healthier lives seems to be the highest level of what that can be. so...
Kelly Berry (47:06) Mm -hmm.
Paul Levitin (47:25) Yeah, but you know, to your point, people will say, see what I mean, four years in 300 plus episodes. That's like, how do you do that? That's so hard. But it goes back to everything that I've been talking about. I'm enthusiastic about it. Not just enthusiastic about having a podcast, right? Like enthusiastic about the result. Oh, that's so cool that you have a top 1 % in the world ranked podcast, blah, blah. Like accolades. It's like, yeah, but are you enthusiastic about doing the day to day drudgery of making a podcast happen? And I can say yes about that because I love this so much. I love doing the recording, doing the editing, doing all of the things, the writing, the talking to people behind the scenes. Like I actually like it. I like the pieces that go into it. Straightforward, right? That was the S in the easier framework. When I first started, I didn't have any of this. I don't know if people are looking now or just, have a nice mic, I have headphones. When I first started, I just literally just was talking into my computer because I knew that if I went and started Googling, how do I start a podcast, they'd give me five mics that I had to narrow it down between and which, which, which podcast platform is like, just started and never stopped. And I figured it out on the way because I made it so simple that like, I didn't have any reason to get in my own way about it. So that's why all this stuff that I've been talking about, again, it transcends everything. just started doing something that I really liked and got better because now I've been doing it. You go back and listen to episode one, episode two, episode three, they're still there. They're not, their sound quality isn't that good. I ramble a bunch. There's, know, I've gotten better over time, but that comes with consistency. was, you know, like I'm 400 episodes in almost and like that, you know, that's reps, right? You're, you, get better with doing things. So it's just that that message to me is just worth spreading and I can talk about it here with you and I can talk about it a hundred times more on my podcast. it's like, these are the conversations that in my opinion, people need to Podcasts changed my life listening to this stuff. I like it unlocked a level of like, okay, there's another way to think about things, right? Life intended, right? Such a good name. You said it when we were talking before you started recording. I think it was something about like, you know, autonomy and like being in the driver's seat of life. That's what I want for everyone. And that's accessible for everyone. We live in a world again of infinite information. 50 years ago, this wasn't possible. You didn't have access to this type of stuff. And like, we live in right now is a transformational time where people have the unique opportunity to not be locked into a nine to five job in a factory, right? You and I make our money online and are able to do things and travel and all this type of stuff. And like, I'm able to spend time when I ride my bike, listening to podcasts and learning, right? I learned, I listened to three hours of podcasts just when I'm commuting or doing the laundry or whatever else. And it's like, I'm learning. that stuff to me It's just so worthwhile and so valuable that I never get burned. I'm just rambling now. So like, just love talking about
Kelly Berry (50:12) Yeah, I love And this has been great. I said it when we started, my goal is just to bring awareness to things that people don't know about, expand the way that they think about things and the way that they approach things. And I think this has been an amazing I know it's going to be incredibly helpful. So I appreciate you being here sharing knowledge and your wisdom with us. And I can't wait to get this out in the world and help people Make change, make their change easier. Yeah, that'd be great. Yeah, but I will, like I said, I'll link to everything Paul has in the show notes and check him out, listen to his thanks so much for being here, Paul. Yeah, have a great
Paul Levitin (50:51) Thank you for having
